Comments on: Summertime and the Posting is Slowing: Notes on Egypt, and on Obama, the NSA and Snowden, and the Social Condition and the Ironies of Consequence http://www.deliberatelyconsidered.com/2013/07/summertime-and-the-posting-is-slowing-notes-on-egypt-and-on-obama-the-nsa-and-snowden-and-the-social-condition-and-the-ironies-of-consequence/ Informed reflection on the events of the day Wed, 15 Jul 2015 17:00:00 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=4.4.23 By: Scott http://www.deliberatelyconsidered.com/2013/07/summertime-and-the-posting-is-slowing-notes-on-egypt-and-on-obama-the-nsa-and-snowden-and-the-social-condition-and-the-ironies-of-consequence/comment-page-1/#comment-26554 Wed, 10 Jul 2013 13:22:00 +0000 http://www.deliberatelyconsidered.com/?p=19411#comment-26554 Greenwald does the very important work of criticizing power,
and he does so in a very uncompromising fashion. This is often to his merit.
However, Prof. Goldfarb is correct that Greenwald does not rationally engage
those he disagrees with, but when criticized immediately goes on the
counter-attack, even when his interlocutor is merely playing devil’s advocate.
Sometimes your opponent has important point to make, and when he or she does, it should be acknowledged, not dismissed as a knee-jerk reaction.

Having said that, as a lawyer, Greenwald wouldn’t necessarily dismiss all surveillance, but primarily that which violates civil liberties and is clearly a “projection of oppressive power.” And it’s interesting that Greenwald has quoted former Democratic Senator Frank Church, who in 1975 said that the surveillance state’s “capability at any time could be turned around on the American people, and no American would have any privacy left, such is the capability to monitor everything: Telephone conversations, telegrams, it doesn’t matter. There would be no place to hide.” I think then that the broader concern is the continually expanding security state, and where the line should be drawn that demarcates not only the acceptable level of surveillance, but also the point of no return.

]]> By: Jeffrey C. Goldfarb http://www.deliberatelyconsidered.com/2013/07/summertime-and-the-posting-is-slowing-notes-on-egypt-and-on-obama-the-nsa-and-snowden-and-the-social-condition-and-the-ironies-of-consequence/comment-page-1/#comment-26553 Fri, 05 Jul 2013 23:32:00 +0000 http://www.deliberatelyconsidered.com/?p=19411#comment-26553 Perhaps
not all surveillance, but his rejection of national security arguments
is nearly total. He is sure they are invariably about those in power
protecting not the public but themselves.This may be so sometimes but he
is too absolute in my judgment. Also he is too quick to vilify those he
disagrees with, rather than engage them. I am editing the text though
following your advice. Please keep in mind, that I think the revelations are important, fear that the way Snowden as his supporters have acted undermines the importance of what he revealed.

]]> By: David Ashley http://www.deliberatelyconsidered.com/2013/07/summertime-and-the-posting-is-slowing-notes-on-egypt-and-on-obama-the-nsa-and-snowden-and-the-social-condition-and-the-ironies-of-consequence/comment-page-1/#comment-26552 Fri, 05 Jul 2013 22:14:00 +0000 http://www.deliberatelyconsidered.com/?p=19411#comment-26552 Jeffrey, can you show us where Greenwald informs us that he is certain that “all surveillance is evil” (for instance, presumably, according to you, he believes it is “evil” for some clerk to look at my income tax return), or should we just read this as cheap, vulgar and easy rhetoric on your part and as a substitute for deliberate consideration?

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